为什么讨厌歧视中东人？为什么中东人聚集区一律被视为差区？

cheapers2003

去过几个中东国家（非动辄人肉炸弹的国家），感觉民风还比较纯朴。在澳洲碰到的中东人也就是校园里和大部分中国人一样乖巧的学生啦。不过塔利班炸佛和911飞机撞楼后，弄的我上飞机看见大胡子裹头的，心里就犯毛。上了高层写字楼看见裹头的大胡子，心里就一震。可是感觉中国对外大型建筑工程的根据地还是在中东，在国际上得到的政治认可也多来于中东。个人觉得歧视是谈不上，根本到不了那个高度。印度不是中东地区，但是在澳洲，除了白人，中国人，最大可能你就碰见他们了。从上学竞争，上班竞聘，车行买车，到中介买房，不管你喜不喜欢咖喱的味道，他们就萦绕在你身边。个人经历，大部分印度人都还不错，自私自利，损人利己的人哪个国家没有。北京秀水巴基斯坦的留学生买东西，现在没有练摊的人会主动打招呼了，知道那都是穷鬼佬，没油水。不知道情同手足的老巴兄弟会不会想，中国朋友为什么讨厌歧视他们了。被西方讨厌歧视的我们是不是继续讨厌歧视那些最后作为我们朋友的国家和其人民呢。趁此帖彻底转型为宗教帖之前，将其引回LZ的视野中。

steven_sa

谈不上什么歧视不歧视的，我的不少中东、印度同学相处的还不错，只是各自有各自的长久以来生活习惯，在这上面有差异没什么奇怪的，在这上面的不认同不能等同于歧视，在电视电影里看到阿拉伯的妇女蒙面可能感觉是一种美感，但现实生活中她们突然出现在你身边也许就是另外一回事了。

jlhan

原帖由 cheapers2003 于 2009-4-12 02:35 发表
去过几个中东国家（非动辄人肉炸弹的国家），感觉民风还比较纯朴。在澳洲碰到的中东人也就是校园里和大部分中国人一样乖巧的学生啦。不过塔利班炸佛和911飞机撞楼后，弄的我上飞机看见大胡子裹头的，心里就犯毛。上了 ...
被西方讨厌歧视的我们是不是继续讨厌歧视那些最后作为我们朋友的国家和其人民呢。

(I will use English since it is much easier and quicker to type.  If you have problems, I will switch back to Chinese.)  

About discrimination, the West (US, Australia) has very little toward Chinese.  I attended graduate school in the US.  First my encounter on this issue was that minorities have advantages in getting into universities and employeed.  I thought that as a Chinese I might qualify.  Be hold!  That was for blacks and American Indians; Chinese do not qualify.  These laws were enacted to correct past mistakes toward blacks and American Indians.  

I have lived and worked in the US for 15 years plus.  If you truely understand their culture and language, I feel there is very little discrimination toward Chinese or other Asians.  Sometimes cultural clash, yes; discrimination no. Toward blacks, yes there are some.  

I have been in Australia for many years.  I would say that Australia is probably not as good as the US as far as discrimination against Chinese is concerned but still is quite good.  First, US and Australia are under rule of laws.  Australian laws do not discriminate against Chinese.  

In mid 90's I taught at USQ.  It originally puzzled me that the best students at USQ are students from Malaysia of Chinese descent.  After going there, I learned that Chinese in Mayalysia were not allowed to attend universities there or worked for good jobs in government.  Chinese in Malaysia is a minority about 25%; only 1% or so can go to Malaysia universities.  These were in strong contrast with the US and Australia.  B. Obama was born in the US.  If he was born in Malaysia, he would not be able to attend universities let alone to get elected.  

Malaysia actually is a better Muslim country for Chinese.  Check out Indonesia.  Chinese there have to change their names and for a while learning Chinese is prohibited.  There have been several riots against Chinese; you may search to find out.  They just kill you, rape you or rob you.  

Many Chinese do not understand the importance of Bible and Koran in Western countries and Muslim countries, respectively.  Common laws came from these books (also Roman laws played an important role).  According to Koran, you will be slaves, or at best second class citizens, if you are Christians or Jews. If you are a Buddist or Hindu, you worship idol and should be killed.  If you believe nothing, you must convert to Muslim or to be killed.  It is not surprising that Muslim countries do not have laws to guarantee equality and none is an immigration country.

[ 本帖最后由 jlhan 于 2009-4-13 03:04 编辑 ]

语阁

原帖由 cheapers2003 于 2009-4-12 02:35 发表
去过几个中东国家（非动辄人肉炸弹的国家），感觉民风还比较纯朴。在澳洲碰到的中东人也就是校园里和大部分中国人一样乖巧的学生啦。不过塔利班炸佛和911飞机撞楼后，弄的我上飞机看见大胡子裹头的，心里就犯毛。上了 ...

老巴的人更差劲 不过中国官方都报喜不报忧。

狄仁杰

美国：想打谁打谁
英国：美国打谁我打谁
俄罗斯：谁骂我、我打谁
法国：谁打我、我打谁
中国：谁打我、我骂谁

大球球

原帖由 狄仁杰 于 2009-4-12 13:09 发表
美国：想打谁打谁
英国：美国打谁我打谁
俄罗斯：谁骂我、我打谁
法国：谁打我、我打谁
中国：谁打我、我骂谁

总结的不错啊

狄仁杰

综合国力决定一切啊。中国正在逐渐恢复到成吉思汗和秦始皇时代。

zl

原帖由 jlhan 于 2009-4-11 14:49 发表

70A。D。以色列是被罗马帝国毁灭，与阿拉伯人有何关系？

以色列打仗是比阿拉伯高两个数量级，不信去查查几次中东战争的书籍。

别动不动就查书，那是赵括，对不起，不知道你是否听说过纸上谈兵的典故？中东战争根本不是以、阿两方的对决是个常识，还谈什么数量级，太搞笑了。

cheapers2003

原帖由 jlhan 于 2009-4-12 10:14 发表

(I will use English since it is much easier and quicker to type.  If you have problems, I will switch back to Chinese.)  

About discrimination, the West (US, Australia) has very little toward Chi ...

谢谢回复。怎么感觉看着看着像宗教贴了，^_^。可能你想说明宗教文化根植入一个民族或国家或区域导致了其卑劣行径或是高尚情操。我不否认宗教信仰对于物质界中人类的精神界的影响，但是好像和本帖的主题有点远了吧。远就远吧，多交流总没坏处。我刚和个马来的华人朋友交流了你说的入学率问题，好像似有出入。印尼对华人几代人的歧视和迫害确实是事实，尤其98大暴动令人发指，而且我在澳洲的印尼华人朋友也都深感生活在印尼的恐怖。我想问问你认为马来和印尼华人命运的不同是为什么呢？

jlhan

原帖由 cheapers2003 于 2009-4-12 16:43 发表


我刚和个马来的华人朋友交流了你说的入学率问题，好像似有出入。印尼对华人几代人的歧视和迫害确实是事实，尤其98大暴动令人发指，而且我在澳洲的印尼华人朋友也都深感生活在印尼的恐怖。我想问问你认为马来和印尼华人命运的不同是为什么呢？

It has been 10 years; so Malaysia may have improved.  

Do not know the differences between Malaysia and Indonesia in details.  Religions or Koran in particular are related to this line because the laws in Muslim countries follow from Koran and/or Islamic traditions.  Now Middle East countries are worse for Chinese to live (visiting is OK) because these are Arab countries and Koran was originally Arabic.  Only very recently, Koran is translated into other languages.  In Asia or other Muslim countries, if their Imams are moderate, these countries laws and policies are more moderate to other peoples including Chinese.

wiwitea

上周我在考虑一个BANKSTOWN的房子，也是因为便宜，想说为了价格就在这住吧，然后晚上去看看周围环境。。。。对面是个CAFE，里面全是中东人的长相的，很多人在抽一种很奇怪的烟，我之前在其他PUB都没见到的，朋友说那是土耳其的水烟，，我不知道是什么啦，
然后再路边站着。。。呼啸而来的跑车都是放着那种大喇叭的咚咚咚的音乐，震的我心脏都要出来了。。。。路边走过的也都是包头巾的中东女人和没包头巾的男人，路过我们身边的时候，，，不少人是用很“奇怪”的眼光看了我们。。。当时的感觉好奇怪。。。

有个朋友说，，中东人太会生了，，比中国人，鬼佬和其他国家的人都能生，他们家庭平均生4，5个的。。。说这样的话，20年后的澳洲就是中东人的天下了。。。偶那个心凉啊。。。。希望是危言耸听的啦！！

狄仁杰

生10个的我都见过，阿拉伯国家是一夫多妻。都是自然选择的结果：
1。百人很容易找到正职工作，自然很有优越感；
2。华人移民多是做小生意或者做廉价劳动力（当然混得好也有，但是不能代表大多数）；
3。澳洲公司招聘员工的优先级一般是：白人--亚裔、印度人--中东人
这些人找不到工作也要生存下来啊，于是就开始成群的生孩子------他们的宗旨是，即使生活再清贫，也比中东地区战火纷飞、枪林弹雨的情况好1000倍。

tracy99

已然是宗教历史研究帖了！

cheapers2003

原帖由 wiwitea 于 2009-4-12 18:02 发表
上周我在考虑一个BANKSTOWN的房子，也是因为便宜，想说为了价格就在这住吧，然后晚上去看看周围环境。。。。对面是个CAFE，里面全是中东人的长相的，很多人在抽一种很奇怪的烟，我之前在其他PUB都没见到的，朋友说那 ...

那烟和整套装备叫Shisha,劲不小。

狄仁杰

中东人不敢惹白人,只好拿亚洲人出气.    所以我们华人社团应该组织一个青龙帮、精武门、斧头帮之类的社团。帮主从足迹网所有的版主里选出。

jlhan

原帖由 狄仁杰 于 2009-4-12 20:42 发表
中东人不敢惹白人,只好拿亚洲人出气.    所以我们华人社团应该组织一个青龙帮、精武门、斧头帮之类的社团。帮主从足迹网所有的版主里选出。

Do not agree.  Please see my previous posts.  Australia is a country ruled by laws.  Even though some may have prejudice against Chinese, they are the minority and they act against the laws.  I can say that most problems in Australia are cultural not racial.  By observing the laws and by good cultural exchanges, we can enjoy our life here.  Secrete societies like 青龙帮 can make things worse not better.

Shuaiyu

原帖由 jlhan 于 2009-4-11 19:19 发表
Well.  A lot must blame on wrong information you get from the communists.  That is why you should read some good books on histories.  

On economic develpment, 陈志武 a Yale professor, has written a ...

实话实说，杨小凯只是个经济学家，不是自然科学家。他说“要看到上帝才信实际上是一个分子水平的思想方法。分子的关系不同，它可以出现很复杂的事情，很复杂的社会现像。而分子之间的关系是看不见的，你就叫它灵好了！”但是分子间的力的作用实际并不是没有规律或者复杂到不可测量的，只是他不知道而已。他的例子是不正确的。更别说还有比分子更小的微粒
我承认他在经济学上的成就，但是他的这篇评论很业余，没有论证，没有论据，也没有多少说服力。即使从经济范畴，他说“凡是新教文明占优势的国家，它的宪政秩序、经济表现就好”。那么为什么东亚，或者说中华文明在18世纪之前一千年一直领先？难道之前你们的主就没有作用？ 恐怕他自己也不信吧
最后的一段可以看出他为什么信教“我也开始讲课了，瘤子消失了。很多兄弟姐妹给我作见证，瘤子是靠祷告消失的。这就是一个见证。当然，你可能说是碰巧了。我的这一段的精神上的灵魂生活绝对是真的。你不要老是停留在那个分子水平上想问题。你就是升高，学点复杂性的灵，同样的分子，不同的组合，会完全出不同的物种，而这个不同的组合就是灵，就是不同的灵魂。”人快死的时候最脆弱的，杨教授患病期间，身边照顾的妻子是一个信徒。当没有别的方法，只能找点安慰了。当然，如果碰巧好了，更就是“主的恩典”了
嘿嘿，我的一个朋友，练了气功治好了病，之后也就成为气功的信徒了。

jlhan

原帖由 Shuaiyu 于 2009-4-12 23:58 发表
即使从经济范畴，他说“凡是新教文明占优势的国家，它的宪政秩序、经济表现就好”。那么为什么东亚，或者说中华文明在18世纪之前一千年一直领先？难道之前你们的主就没有作用？

I have a line open on economics
澳股和经济趋势小谈
http://www.oursteps.com.au/bbs/v ... &extra=page%3D1
Read them first.  

I also have posts in the line
复活节探讨基督教信仰
http://www.oursteps.com.au/bbs/viewthread.php?tid=143598
on sciences and religions.  Check them out.

狄仁杰

原帖由 jlhan 于 2009-4-12 20:51 发表

Do not agree.  Please see my previous posts.  Australia is a country ruled by laws.  Even though some may have prejudice against Chinese, they are the minority and they act against the laws.  I can  ...

please tell me where is your previous posts，could you please show me the weblink?           "Australia is a country ruled by laws",do you still believe the damn words?  wake up mate!  
难道你不知道曹博士遇害的案子吗？难道你不知道waterloo中国女孩被强奸后被迫跳楼的事情吗（不了了之）？难道你不知道焦丹被害一年多凶手以精神病为理由逍遥法外吗(最近迫于舆论界压力才开始审判凶手的) ？
“Even though some may have prejudice against Chinese, they are the minority and they act against the laws.”  what a shit theory! 如果你还执迷不悟要等到澳洲法律为你伸张正义的时候，那么下一个喋血街头的可能就是你。

Shuaiyu

原帖由 jlhan 于 2009-4-13 01:28 发表

I have a line open on economics
澳股和经济趋势小谈
http://www.oursteps.com.au/bbs/v ... &extra=page%3D1
Read them first.  

I also have posts in the line
复活节探讨基督教信 ...

Do you(or 韩家亮 you quoted） really understand Chinese concepts 价格 and 价值？ Not really some convincing articles. Also if you want to reply to me, answer my question directly instead of refering to other posts. I have no interest to read them.
基督 means nothing to me honestly and I'm not afraid of hell or heaven at all because I don't believe it exists.

margaretyy

jlhan

I got an idea.  Dr. R.G. Brown at Duke was my colleague.  Most likely he is not a Christian.  The link to him is
http://fds.duke.edu/db/aas/Physics/faculty/rgb

NTKa can email him and ask him whether (1) asshole is a correct word to use against him and (2) will he take him as a student.

luckypig

战场转移到这里来了

语阁

原帖由 狄仁杰 于 2009-4-13 06:50 发表


please tell me where is your previous posts，could you please show me the weblink?           "Australia is a country ruled by laws",do you still believe the damn words?  wake up mate!  
难道你不知 ...

人家又不是被中东人害死的，拿中东人说啥事。

NTka

原帖由 jlhan 于 2009-4-14 06:22 发表
I got an idea.  Dr. R.G. Brown at Duke was my colleague.  Most likely he is not a Christian.  The link to him is
http://fds.duke.edu/db/aas/Physics/faculty/rgb

NTKa can email him and ask him whet ...

我还能说什么呢？有你这样的信徒我相信你的主都会感到羞耻。

50岁的人了还这么不淡定，白活了。
干嘛要问你Duke的同事？那都是什么时候的事了，我还是问问你在USQ的同事好了。

jlhan

原帖由 NTka 于 2009-4-14 08:38 发表
别忘自己是怎么被中南矿业学院推荐去Duke的，做人还是不要忘本的好。  

In 1980, if you said this to me.  I would probably say "Son of bitch.  Are you a communist spy?"  I was not a Christian then, so forgive me for the false word.   

The truth was 中南矿业学院 administration persecuted me to the point of break down.  If were not for their effort or if China is not a communist country I would have already won Nobel Prize in physics by now.  
http://boxun.com/hero/200904/tianliang/2_1.shtml