请还CO2一个清白

ghj

一个简单的事实是：地球表面的温度，是有太阳决定的活动。历史数据表明，太阳（黑子）活动活跃时期，气温自然就升高了。反之，则气温下降。
地球表面的温度在按照一个周期波动变化的，跟人类活动产生CO2无关。
鼓吹CO2是气候变暖是一帮所谓的“科学家”与政客的利益所在。

详细说明请看视频。



[ 本帖最后由 ghj 于 2011-7-11 19:04 编辑 ]

ghj

不负有心人

这个是从GLOBAL WARMING的角度来说。

那个是从空气污染的角度来讲。FOR A MORE CLEAR BEAUTIFUL SKY

各说各的。各有各的利益驱使。

billtheman

花费做出这个影片的人的资金来源和目的是什么？不仅仅是科学真相那么简单吧。

貔貅

哎 碳碳碳 今天听了一天了都

不负有心人

一天啊，还会继续延续

jasonliu234

原帖由 不负有心人 于 2011-7-11 19:14 发表
这个是从GLOBAL WARMING的角度来说。

那个是从空气污染的角度来讲。FOR A MORE CLEAR BEAUTIFUL SKY

各说各的。各有各的利益驱使。

CO2无色无味，本就和less clear sky无关。

qianqian2007

人定胜天嘛，不是只有中国人有这种豪情的。科学家有时候为了糊口也是会糊弄人的，别当真。

flame21

我的理解是，温室效应确实存在，虽然说太阳黑子也有影响。

但我反对碳税， 最大原因是，政府拿这个碳税，只是因为之前乱花，现在缺钱了。他们即使得到钱，也不会“公平有效”地把这钱用在减排上，根据过往经验，肯定绝大部分是被他们不知怎么浪费掉了。

yaoda

原帖由 ghj 于 2011-7-11 18:54 发表
一个简单的事实是：地球表面的温度，是有太阳决定的活动。历史数据表明，太阳（黑子）活动活跃时期，气温自然就升高了。反之，则气温下降。
地球表面的温度在按照一个周期波动变化的，跟人类活动产生CO2无关。
鼓吹CO2是气候变暖是一帮所谓的“科学家”与政客的利益所在。

详细说明请看视频。

http://www.youtube.com/v/Di5FyndJbz0

Sorry to bust you bubble but we are in a Sun activity minimum cycle but 2010 was the hottest year on record.
Sun acitivity does have some effect on global temperature but now it can no longer explain the warming we are experiencing NOW.

高寿财

曲棍球杆形的曲线，
是人为操作数据的结果。


[ 本帖最后由 高寿财 于 2011-7-14 12:57 编辑 ]

yaoda

原帖由 高寿财 于 2011-7-14 12:53 发表
曲棍球杆形的曲线，
是人为操作数据的结果。

So.... you just showed a graph of solar activity. I showed a graph of solar activity and global temperature averages.
But thank you for the graph because it showed from 2005 till 2010 we are at Solar MINIMUM.
But our global temperature is highest. So Sun activity is the NOT the cause of current high temperatures.

高寿财

LS的自我感觉真好啊！
11楼的图是振荡持平。
10楼的图为何solar activity从1980年一直走低呢？

我只不过要你知道操纵数据骗人是不对的。

yaoda

1980 - 2010 3 个 solar cycle.
为什么 global temperature 1980 - 2010 没有 cycle, 而是升高呢。
说明 sun acitivty 不能解释 global warming.
你把12楼的图 从 1960 更我下面图比一下结论更明显。


你的图是 annual average.
前10楼面图是 11 year average.怎么能算 操纵。
raw data 没有改变。

Devil_Star

I got overwhelmed by all those debates about whether global warming is true or not. I honestly cant tell what is true. But I personally tend to believe the temperature rise recorded, if true, is primarily caused by urban heat island effects and heat rejection of power stations and other thermal processes.

高寿财

特意用11年平均数据，
是否为了曲线更看得顺眼，
更能支持“太阳活动下降的同时温度上升”这个预设的结论

yaoda

I don't blame you for being overwhelmed. There is ALOT of false information out there. And these false information are backed by special interests to propagate far and wide and to muddle the truth. That's why I feel as a scientist to clarify the truth on behalf of my fellow scientists who are being unfairly treated and often misrepresented.
I remember the old saying that particularly suit the global warming issue: It is also very hard to make people to understand something when their lifestyles or livelihood depends on NOT understanding it.
This is why the al gore movie was titled : The inconvenient truth.

As for the urban heat island effect
http://www.skepticalscience.com/urban-heat-island-effect.htm

And for the heat rejection
http://www.sciencedirect.com/sci ... i/S0360544210005694

I agree that more efficient power station should be used to minimise heat rejection and power wastage.

yaoda

原帖由 高寿财 于 2011-7-14 14:35 发表
特意用11年平均数据，
是否为了曲线更看得顺眼，
更能支持“太阳活动下降的同时温度上升”这个预设的结论

No, the conclusion is the same.
Sun activity DO　ＮＯＴ　correlate to current global temperature rise.

If I say "Sun activity has negative effect on global temperature rise" and used the 11 year average as evidence then you may have a better case.

高寿财

即使用11年平均，
1980-2000年太阳活动不可能像10楼图里那样
基本下降，
还那么多。

不知用了什么复杂的算法程序
不知有什么依据要用11年数据平均。

yaoda

You can try.
For every said year eg. 1980, take annual average that year and +/- 5 years so 1975 to 1985 to make that data point.
Do that from 1980 to 2004 and see what you get.
1980 = average (1975 - 1985)
1981 =average (1976- 1986)
1982 = average (1977 - 1987)
etc etc. and plot.
The reason why 11 year was used because that's about the time span of a solar cycle. so it removes the cyclic nature which can obscure longterm trends and so for better comparison.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_cycle

Devil_Star

原帖由 yaoda 于 2011-7-14 14:39 发表
I don't blame you for being overwhelmed. There is ALOT of false information out there. And these false information are backed by special interests to propagate far and wide and to muddle the truth. Th ...

Thanks for sharing the info and your views. Do you mind telling us what research area you specialise in?

yaoda

My specialty is physical chemistry and nanomaterials but I have been a avid reader on the global warming issue for many years.

yuxuanlin

原帖由 yaoda 于 2011-7-14 15:15 发表
My specialty is physical chemistry and nanomaterials but I have been a avid reader on the global warming issue for many years.

这位同学，请从地球发展史的年限来比较数据，而不是5年，10年，20年，或者30年。

就算你按科学家的提议60年一个轮回来研究，得出的结论会更客观些。

人才在地球上活动多久啊？地球经历了几次气候变化啊？在人类出现以前，地球的变冷，恐龙的灭绝，难道都是后来人类造成滴？

yaoda

原帖由 yuxuanlin 于 2011-7-14 15:20 发表


这位同学，请从地球发展史的年限来比较数据，而不是5年，10年，20年，或者30年。

就算你按科学家的提议60年一个轮回来研究，得出的结论会更客观些。

人才在地球上活动多久啊？地球经历了几次气候变化啊？在人类出现以前，地球的变冷，恐龙的灭绝，难道都是后来人类造成滴？

So what are you trying to say? I'm don't understand the point of your post.
You want us to wait another 60 years and do nothing?
I posted dinasour before as a JOKE. Perhaps my sense of dry humour is lost in translation. Unless you are a bible basher, human and dinasour DID NOT coexist.
Human only avaiable on this earth for around 250000 years but the industrial revolution started only about 250 years ago and really took off last 150 years. And in the last 150 years we achieved thousands time more technological advanced than the rest of 250000 years put together thanks to science. Without sicence, you will live in stone age still. Why doubt science now, because its too inconvenient for you that you have to give up your McMansions and SUVs?

yuxuanlin

原帖由 yaoda 于 2011-7-14 15:40 发表


So what are you trying to say? I'm don't understand the point of your post.
You want us to wait another 60 years and do nothing?
I posted dinasour before as a JOKE. Perhaps my sense of dry humour i ...

你是绿党支持者，我不跟你辩论了。

yaoda

Hahahaha, does believing in SCIENCE and evidence makes one a  green supporter?
Personally I think the Greens are full of idealistic dreamers.
You can't argue with facts so result to labelling. Low blow my friend.
I am only here to clarify facts. If you have hard scientific evidence to suggest otherwise then I am happy to learn and change my views. At the moment my view is the same as other 90+% fellow scientists, and that is anthropogenic global warming is real.

ITtraining

原帖由 yuxuanlin 于 2011-7-14 15:20 发表


这位同学，请从地球发展史的年限来比较数据，而不是5年，10年，20年，或者30年。

就算你按科学家的提议60年一个轮回来研究，得出的结论会更客观些。

人才在地球上活动多久啊？地球经历了几次气候变化啊？在人类出现以前，地球的变冷，恐龙的灭绝，难道都是后来人类造成滴？

恐龙放屁太多造成的温室气体

[ 本帖最后由 ITtraining 于 2011-7-14 16:30 编辑 ]

yaoda

Hahahahaha,  that is funny.
Maybe that's why Jurrasic period had 12 times much CO2 than now.
And maybe methane too!

Very nice self-sustaining system. Fart causing warming, warming good for reptiles. Until a meteorite ruined the party...

cangaru

人类还是能左右地球命运的，比如把所有核弹头都爆一遍，基本地球就到核冬天的冰川时代了

烧煤和化石燃料只是死得慢些罢了

cocowhite

以前也听说一科学家说：无论什么怎么糟蹋地球，地球都是不在乎的，人类太高估自己的破坏能力了。所以什么碳税都是扯淡的事情。