再问work related travel cost

oz2009

我的情况是去年去中国100天。公司每天给吃饭的钱是75刀。不要发票，也不交税。

现在如果我要用ATO的215刀的meal+incident的标准去claim 每天140刀的gap, 是不是我必须把我 75刀 x 100 =7500 刀也claim 成income去补交税收？

3IX37

No, i don't think so. Please correct me anyone if I am wrong, if you are using the reasonable amount published on TD2012/17, you should be fine, subject you actually spent more than it. and travel diary needs to be kept for tax purpose.

Please refer my other post in relation to record-keeping requirement for information.

http://www.oursteps.com.au/bbs/f ... read&tid=560156

LENNY_DONG

I think you must have travel allowance to claim ato rule expense

JohnnySu

You can claim your actual out-of-pocket travel expenses (i.e. what you have spent - what you got back from your employer). However you can not rely on the substantiation exemption (the commissioner's rates) because the allowance you have received from your employer is not showing as taxable on your group certificate.

oz2009

3IX37 发表于 2012-10-4 07:51
No, i don't think so. Please correct me anyone if I am wrong, if you are using the reasonable amount ...

' subject you actually spent more than it.'.

Do you mean the actual expense with proof on receipt? rather than daily allowance?

I did not spent over $215 on average.

But I have the document on how much my company compensated me as daily allowance. (document showing trip details including accommodation, daily allowance, taxi, flight, etc) but not on PAYG.

3IX37

oz2009 发表于 2012-10-4 10:28
' subject you actually spent more than it.'.

Do you mean the actual expense with proof on receipt ...

In short and simply way, if you are not claiming more than the reasonable amount stated by the commissioner in the TD2012/17, you should be fine. But the travel diary needs to be kept.

For example, your company reimbursed you $100 for your work travel, this should be treated as your income and it should be either in your gorss wage or a separate item as allowance stated on your PAYG. (this is not your responsibilty to make sure it is correctly stated) On the other hand you can claim up to $ 215 for your deduction (if this is the reasonable amount accepted for the place you travelled).  You can only claim how much you really spent up to the reasonable amount before you don't need to provide the invoices. if you claim more than that, you need to provide all invoices for all expenses.


I hope this clears your doubt.

JohnnySu

oz2009 发表于 2012-10-4 10:28
' subject you actually spent more than it.'.

Do you mean the actual expense with proof on receipt ...

You can only rely on the commissioner's rate when a taxable travel allowance is paid. your discussion is completely out of line

3IX37

taxbreak 发表于 2012-10-4 11:06
You can only rely on the commissioner's rate when a taxable travel allowance is paid. your discuss ...

You are right, and isn't it fact here, the employer paid the travel allowance? it say the allowance is paid, not stated on PAYG. Don't you agree?

and if you read the subdivision 900-B, you should've know the exception rule is for the expenses incurred that is related not only to an allowance but also to a reimbursement paid or payable by the employer. :)

JohnnySu

The travel allowance has to be taxable allowance to be qualified for the substantiation exemption. If is it not taxable you may still claim your expense but you can not rely on the commissioner's rate. See #4

3IX37

taxbreak 发表于 2012-10-4 11:23
The travel allowance has to be taxable allowance to be qualified for the substantiation exemption. I ...

You are not saying the reimbursement received from employer is not taxable, are you? :)

Maybe you should read the law instead of the rulings my friend. the ruling is only the intepretation of the law by commissioner. :)

JohnnySu

3IX37 发表于 2012-10-4 11:28
maybe you should read the law instead of the rulings my friend. the ruling is only the intepretati ...

The allowance can either be taxable or non-taxable depending on how the employer treat it but if you look at #1 he is saying the allowance is non-taxable and when it is non-taxable you can not rely on the commissioner's rate.

Isn't it the whole point of your discussions here you are trying to rely on this ATO ruling?  I do not understand what you are trying to argue? but anyways.

3IX37

What is travel allowance, it is your employer pays or is to pay to you to cover losses or outgoings you incurred for travel, accommondation, food and drinks and any incidentals. and the travel can be both domestic or international. (s.900-30)

and I believe the allowance is assessable under s.6-5. :)

JohnnySu

3IX37 发表于 2012-10-4 11:48
What is travel allowance, it is your employer pays or is to pay to you to cover losses or outgoings  ...

When the allowance is FBT taxable it is not assessable to the employee. The employer pays FBT but maybe eligible for FBT concessions...

3IX37

taxbreak 发表于 2012-10-4 11:45
The allowance can either be taxable or non-taxable depending on how the employer treat it but if y ...

Sorry mate, i am not arguing against you. and i didn't mean to offend you. I am just simply pointing things out. No hard feelings mate :)
You are right. it is a common sense that one can't claim expenses incurred for the income not assessable. But i don't think it is the case here my friend. :)

JohnnySu

3IX37 发表于 2012-10-4 11:53
Sorry mate, i am not arguing against you. and i didn't mean to offend you. I am just simply pointi ...

You are not offending anyone. You are just showing your lack of understanding of the tax system that is all:)

3IX37

taxbreak 发表于 2012-10-4 12:05
You are not offending anyone. You are just showing your lack of understanding of the tax system th ...

wow, I like your way of thinking :)

You are all right in theory.

Let's get the bottom of this topic to see how little i undserstand the tax system :) .

Again you are right, as a payment reimbursement, in theory, it can be a fringe benefit. and for the reimbursement and allowance, there is never a clear definition in the both FBT Act and ITAA.

The common understanding is per TR92/15
If the payment by employer is exact the expenses incurred by employee, it is reimbursement, and FBT Act might kick in.
and if the payment by employer to an employee is base on the estimate, it is an allowance.
Furthremore, s.15-2 ITAA1997 clearly specifies that allowance should be included in the assessable income.


Hey, it is fine by me, if you advise all your clients in similar circumstances that they can't deduct their travel expenses based on your understanding. it is just one intepretation. :)

oz2009

3IX37 发表于 2012-10-4 10:51
In short and simply way, if you are not claiming more than the reasonable amount stated by the com ...

In ur example, if I spent 210 dollar, I can claim 110 dollar only, right.

But what about the100 dollar my company gave to me. Should I add this into my income and pay tax for it?

3IX37

oz2009 发表于 2012-10-4 14:10
In ur example, if I spent 210 dollar, I can claim 110 dollar only, right.

But what about the100 d ...

In this example, the payment you get from your employer $ 100 is an assessable allowance, which should be included in your tax return as an income. and $ 210 is the reasonable amount accepted by the commissioner if you don't have invoices.

zfpurple

纯英语帖

oz2009

3IX37 发表于 2012-10-4 15:25
In this example, the payment you get from your employer $ 100 is an assessable allowance, which sh ...

Thanks.

100 income
210 work related travel and no invoice.

3IX37

Easy, it is not yet over. As you traveled 100 days, even you don't need to provide invoice as you are using the reasonable amount, I would suggest that u still need to have a travel diary which records the purpose of each trip, spending, the supplier and the amount.

banzhiyan

学习

oz2009

3IX37 发表于 2012-10-4 16:53
Easy, it is not yet over. As you traveled 100 days, even you don't need to provide invoice as you ar ...

the company should provide me a report to include all travel details.

I have submitted tax return this year, if i filled out a form to modify the tax return, as an expert, you recon any drama?

oz2009

还有就是cost group是根据salary来的。

salary是指 before deduction的salary /wage. 还是指taxable income呢？

3IX37

Any inconsistency will trigger ATO to look at issue twice, but since your claim is legit, why should u worry?

Salary is the amount on your PAYG payment summary statement, and it is grossed up before your withholding.

May1511

3IX37 发表于 2012-10-4 19:40
Any inconsistency will trigger ATO to look at issue twice, but since your claim is legit, why should ...

学习了

JohnnySu

反正如果travel allowance没有显示在group certificate上 是不能用commissioner's rates的 风险都是自己承担的 报之前再仔细看看ATO 的东西吧

oz2009

3IX37 发表于 2012-10-4 16:53
Easy, it is not yet over. As you traveled 100 days, even you don't need to provide invoice as you ar ...

大师， 那公司给我的100也要报税是吧。

如果是的，写在哪个section?

Bailey

Mark, 也是出差2个月. 虽然是实报实销, 还是有一些Out of Pocket expense, for other incidental. 不知道可以报税吗?

JohnnySu

Bailey 发表于 2012-10-6 13:10
Mark, 也是出差2个月. 虽然是实报实销, 还是有一些Out of Pocket expense, for other incidental. 不知道可 ...

可以报out of pocket 但是要保留票据